Rift: Planes of Telara

[Kanuni]

oldurulemeyende OP dir :P

[sardius]

benim oynadıgım serverda tank yok herkes cleric ve rog:)

[Norak]

gloamdaki hag questini bitirdim az önce, bayaaa bi sürdü kaleye girme çıkma vb ama sağ sağlim sololadım :)

o clericte warden veya purifier vardır büyük ihtimal, onlar heal class zaten

[Asgard]

evet healerlar baya op şuanda,zaten warfrontlarda kimse clericlere dalmaya cesaret edemiyor.Ama ilerde bunun değişeceğini düşünüyorum yani millete stun-silence zart zurt gelecek elbet ki bunlarıda kullanırlarsa clericlerin op liği yarı yarıya düşer diye ümit ediyorum.

[TM]

ben 41 levelde riftblade ile 44 cleric ve mageyi aldım, mageler zaten pek kolay oluyor riftblade için cleric'de heal yetiştiremedi. Kaldıki rogue ile doğru route ile ayılamadan öldürmen lazım. En azından 4x levellerde genelde bayılan ayılamıyor.

[TM]

#
How to fix Clerics and an overall review of Clerics

The main trouble with this class is you are above average at your main calling, and sub par in comparison to other classes in different roles.

This stems from a number of issues-balance-how do you give the primary archetype that can heal the ability to tank or DPS and not create an all-too-powerful class that can "do it all."

The items I am proposing deal with that aspect in the game play.

Issue 1: Gear
Right now-based on raid testing and solo play-the game is broken out into gear types for certain roles. For example, Justicar Tanks would need a shield to be effective. Not only that piece-but they would need other gear that boosts their defensive abilities. This gear would take away stats that can allow them to heal-or cast damage. The same is true for anyone wishing to do anything in a specific stat line. If you are wanting to play Inquisitor or Cabal-you'd find it more advantageous to wear cloth and get Int and Spell Crit gear to be effective.

The more that roles get dispersed into gear checks-the less players can multi-use different roles. Different roles, and differing abilities within the same calling is a strength of this game because it keeps players from getting bored playing the same style over and over again.

This is true especially for the cleric. Who would want a justicar tank (assuming their agro was fixed)when the likelihood is they aren't geared adequately for that role. And if they ARE geared for the Justicar Tank role, then they aren't geared to heal, or DPS. They're locked in by gear alone.

You have to fix this with buffs that mitigate the primary calling stat lines of healing and sets the character with appropriate stats for the desired role. You attempt this mildly with Mien of Leadership, but 130% of 0 = 0. I will come back to this type of problem throughout.

Issue 2: Healing
Warden has the best HPS output of all healing builds, and zero 3 second casts and a majority of the casts are instant. Its the primary reason I have yet to make a solo heal build that is useful without Warden in it. HoT's buy you time. That's invaluable in an expert where so many scripts require you to move, or do force pulls where you are interrupted.

Sentinel is not nearly as bad as purifier-primarily because you get Healing Breath, Touch the Light, Serendipity, Healer's Haste, all things that aim at speeding up cast times. Purifiers get none of that. And your unique utility damage wards do nothing in comparison to Healer's Covenant (Sentinel - 40% reduction for 9s). When you compare it to Warden's abilities, Orbs of the Stream will heal for 3k+, over time, Healer's Covenant may reduce more than 4k damage. Equate that with Purifier's miserable use with Ward's and it just doesn't make adequate sense to spec it.

A pure spec'd purifiers main asset is Sterilize because it can cure bleeds. It's damage shields just dont absorb enough damage to make it worthwhile, and if you offset that with having no way to speed up cast times you are not much use as a heal spec. Slow to cast-and little utility.

Aside from class differences, the next issue is Mana Pool and casting stats. Wisdom-clerics primary stat, gives very little in terms of casting ability. 4 Primary Casting Stats: Spell Power, Spell Crit, Mana Pool, and Mana Regen. Int gives 3/4 and wis gives 2/4, and 1 of the 2 is the least important. You lose out in Mana Pool and Spell Crit. This is an issue. As mana use has gone up, clerics are burning through mana much more quickly. Part of this is because their primary stat does nothing to increase their mana. This means dual speccing stats for clerics is more necessary than it is for Mages. Mages can solely focus on int, and in turn, they build Spell Power, Spell Crit and Mana Pool. We get Spell Power and Mana Regen. Try to go as an inquisitor and your stats are already skewed against you because of the lack of spell crit.


Issue 3: tanking (Justicar)
The build itself has some flaws. First, I think Trion went in the right direction in terms of balance where Mien of Leadership reduces DPS and Healing abilities. They also went in the direction I think they need to go more in where the MoL ability is meant to adjust the stats to what is suitable. It increases Armor, HP, and all defensive stats as well as threat generation. The most important ability for a tank is the ability to hold agro. Justicars get 1 force taunt for every 3 seconds (It doesn't work at all) and Precept of Valiance increases agro for all attacks (which consequently doesn't hold agro at all).

Compare that versus Warriors-the pinnacle of tanks. They get multiple AOE agros that go upwards to 10 mobs. They also have individual abilities that increase threat. Since MoL decreases damage, and none of the clerics ability ALSO generate threat-there is virtually no threat generation for a Justicar to maintain agro.

The easiest fix IMO is to first fix Bolt of Radiance. 3 Second force taunt is adequate. Second, mechanically turn Precept of Valiance into an AOE taunt. Instead of increasing threat per attack based on convictions, make it force taunt mobs per conviction, say 2/Conviction.

The only trouble with this Soul is the gear dependencies I sited before. The shields in the game for clerics are VERY inadequate. They are low armor-and they remove all other beneficial stats for the cleric. They give no spell power, and rarely ever do they grant block.

As I said earlier, 130% of 0 is 0. You have to base the stats off of something that clerics are actually going to have. For example, make their block rating 200% of their Wisdom. At 50 in T2 Gear with some raid drops, I have about 340 wisdom. You could cap the benefit from Wisdom alone. 200% but no more than 600. This puts a T2 geared cleric in similar specs on block rating as a warrior. Valor already tries to attempt this, but 25% of SP at the current state is only going to give 250 or so block. That's half of whats needed. You need to scale it so that we can achieve a workable block rating-whether through MoL or a spec line like Valor.

Since no gear gives dex, we need to make sure the base line that grants %'s is basing it off something we actually have. Not sure about warriors comparitively, but they will have more Dexterity than us in general, which means they gain more in the value of Dodge/Parry etc. Ours should scale appropriately based off of SP or Wisdom.

Again-what is the likelyhood that you can find an appropriately geared cleric for all aspects of their role? Slim if I have to have 3 different kinds for each role set. Archetypes will be gearlocked into doing 1 given thing, making justicars obsolete because most raiding guilds will just have warriors focus on tanking because its more logical and makes the most sense.

Issue 4: Melee DPS

Again-gear wise, we dump into wisdom, and accent int. This means our stats dillute themselves from the outset. Mages spec int, warriors typically gain STR/DEX/END from their gear. This reduces our base line spell crit-which in turn means we have a less physical crit for melee.

Then there is the issue of specing DPS for an Archetype who's primary role is healing. You have to maintain balance.

Passives was the right direction-BUT-also in the name of accenting damage and reducing healing. If I am specing Druid/Shaman-I am typically doing so to melee dps. But currently, we are gimped in Single Target DPS as meleers. Passively, at 15 points into Shaman or Druid, we should be increasing our DPS and decreasing our healing abilities. Courage and Fae lines could for example give a 100 (Spell Power(SP)/Spell Crit(SC))-100 (Attack Power(AP)/Attack Crit(AC)) conversion. At 16 points into the soul, it goes to 95 (SP)(SC) - 105 (AP)(AC) and it would scale with more points in Shaman or Druid respectively.

What this allows, is when I spec a shaman or druid, the heavier I spec, the more I become a melee DPS type than a healing DPS type. The less SP I have, the less I will be able to heal or be a caster. Then I avoid the balance of being able to hybrid spec too heavily and be able to DPS equal to others, with the added utility of absorbing and/or healing.

Again-the issue of being gear-locked is also in play, but its not as heavy here as it is for Justicar.

Issue 5: Caster DPS

We have similar issues, but Inquisitor is more viable in terms of its actual output to other classes.Here, rather than have a buff that gives Armor, have a buff that reduces Wisdom by 40% and increases Intelligence by that amount.This shift alters stats more in line with mages, which is the basis for how spell damage is actually supposed to work. We should be challenging the 800-900 single target damage rate self buffed-and currently, this one is about 30% off.

Outside of Inquisitor, Cabalist is still an unfriendly DPS build. So much of its DPS is based off of build ups that frankly aren't as powerful as the time it takes to build them up-nor as useful. The main role lacking in the game IMO is a situational Debuffer/DOT caster. Think Shaman EQ1. Damage doesn't have to be nuke related, but they could weaken, debuff, dot, or use syphon debuffs that augment the party/raid. Overall-this soul IMO is the most defunct in the entire class build. I see nothing that says I should use it over another soul in any regard-and I haven't run into anyone thats using Cabals as their primary in the game.


Issue 6: Buffing
Shared purpose is great-except for a few things. It stacking with nothing from the rogue line makes it useless. As most raids will carry a bard. It does stack with archon-which is great-but it creates chaos and deminishes a calling when they can't buff because another class cancels or worse has better buffs and still cancels. Heart lines do not scale at all in leveling or with points-which is a terrible direction given it limits to 2 lines and other classes can buff for all lines in heavier amounts.

Endurance buffs dont stack with most other classes-and again-our +40 buff is substandard to other classes. So not only do we get canceled, we are the weakest of the bunch. It makes utterly no sense in the concept of MMOs to not have classes that can blend and buff. For example, a cleric, rogue, mage and warrior get a 4 person grp together. There is absolutely no reason that every person in that group should not be able to cast their buffs. Currently, the cleric buffs from any soul would be rendered obsolete by the bard. That's not good for a game with MMO in it. You want us to come together. You want us to make each other stronger. Currently we cant.

Its a game mechanic that makes grouping clumsy at times, and makes raiding a pain to organize buffs. A shaman spec'd for Shared Purpose devoted 5 points in their spec to do so, and their heart lines dont scale beyond a 30 pt buff (Should go to 50+ IMO) and every other class cancels what they can share anyway.

Would it be so bad as to have people in a raid that WANT a shaman for their Courage of the Eagle and Heart Buffs? Bards will be in every raid-because their buffs are so essential. This deminishes anything a cleric might bring, and if it weren't for healing alone-we'd be obsolete.
__________________________________________________ __________________________________________________ ___

The big item to keep in mind here-is Clerics are not inept, they are not incompetent and it's not so dire that they are "not wanted" in raids. The problem with that type of feedback is there's nothing constructive to take from it. It deminishes any arguments you might have because you come across as the 3 year old screaming "mine!" about every other toy in the room.

Clerics are below average in their other roles-but they aren't inept. They need to be boosted in these aspects while other utilities need to be managed and offset so as not to not create an imbalance in the game.

I've played this game for a total play time of almost 400 hours, of that about 300 hours have been spent on cleric. I've run every dungeon in the game as cleric, in standard, and expert. I have about 25+ expert runs to my credit-and 6 different Greenscale runs. I've run as every spec in the game except as a Justicar Tank-and that's simply because of being gear locked, and when I wasn't finally gear locked, the class just can't manage agro. BUT-I have tested Justicar.

All that said-this list imo is a basis of what I believe would cure a lot of the problems with this class. It doesn't solve everything, but its my laundry list from what I have noticed in the course of playing cleric.

[TM]

expert'den aldigimiz 1 hasar geçmedik mi bunları geçtik bitirdik ama örnek olarak veriyorum aslında 1 bossta 7.5k dmg vurduğu ss vardı ama bulamadım.

[hailandkill]

ya bırsey dıcem de dusundugum seyı yazmak yazmamak arasında kaldım belkı benle acayip dalga geçersiniz... ben wow daki yeşillik ve onun tadındaki renkleri aradım etraf sürekli boğuk ortam sürekli gri sanki siyah beyaz tv de oyun oynuyor gibi hissettim... açıkçası noob da olabilirim ama ben bu çayır çimen olayını özledim ... benim gibi düşünen oldu mu ?

[Jaruza]

defiant mı oynuyorsun? guardians mapleri gayet yeşillik çimlik abi :D

[hailandkill]

ayrıca oyunu kötülemek gibi olmasın ben cidden oyunu boğuk buldum acep ekran kartımda mı high da bile çalıştı inanamadım 9600 gt palit var 512 mb 256 bit

[Norak]

uçan binek olcak mı acaba bunda

[Asgard]

sanmam,world pvp vaad ediyolar uçan binek gelirse wowa döner

[Xenocide]

hailandkill said:

ya bırsey dıcem de dusundugum seyı yazmak yazmamak arasında kaldım belkı benle acayip dalga geçersiniz... ben wow daki yeşillik ve onun tadındaki renkleri aradım etraf sürekli boğuk ortam sürekli gri sanki siyah beyaz tv de oyun oynuyor gibi hissettim... açıkçası noob da olabilirim ama ben bu çayır çimen olayını özledim ... benim gibi düşünen oldu mu ?

valla renk olarak bi kere denildiği gibi guardianın ortamı daha yeşilli meşilli sanırsam, onun haricinde rift denen olaydan dolayı gökyüzü rengi değişiyor sık sık. bir de bulunduğun zone'da bazı bölgelerin yine havası falan değişiyor, böyle kahverengi, pis bi hava falan olabiliyor sdfg yoksa şu gayet yeşilli meşilli, görkemli bi görüntü;

http://img842.imageshack.us/img842/5773/201112605759.jpg

[Xenocide]

abi ben bu arada hala meridian şehrinin olduğu zone'dayım ve bir sonraki zone'a nereden geçicez bulamadım asdf

buldum :)

[hailandkill]

Xenocide said:

hailandkill said:

ya bırsey dıcem de dusundugum seyı yazmak yazmamak arasında kaldım belkı benle acayip dalga geçersiniz... ben wow daki yeşillik ve onun tadındaki renkleri aradım etraf sürekli boğuk ortam sürekli gri sanki siyah beyaz tv de oyun oynuyor gibi hissettim... açıkçası noob da olabilirim ama ben bu çayır çimen olayını özledim ... benim gibi düşünen oldu mu ?

valla renk olarak bi kere denildiği gibi guardianın ortamı daha yeşilli meşilli sanırsam, onun haricinde rift denen olaydan dolayı gökyüzü rengi değişiyor sık sık. bir de bulunduğun zone'da bazı bölgelerin yine havası falan değişiyor, böyle kahverengi, pis bi hava falan olabiliyor sdfg yoksa şu gayet yeşilli meşilli, görkemli bi görüntü;

http://img842.imageshack.us/img842/5773/201112605759.jpg

gayet güzel ... :p

[nevarya]

Guardian dan nefret ettiğim andır.Hayır utandım resmen ya...sinirlendimde...Oynadığım serverdaki tüm gurdianları teker teker çekip black garden da önemli olanın şu flag olduğunu ve onu alanın korunması gerektiğini izah etmem lazım...

Guardian o yeşil şuhuya kaptırmış gidiyor kendini şuursuzca :D

Eski postları okudumda şimdi isyanmı çıkmış? clericlermi çıkarmış? Panayır zencisidir onlar.Öyle diim ben.

Rog oynuyorum bende kavramam baya zaman aldı ama ass deep gittim riftstalker kulladım 8 puan kadar.Ve oradaki yorum doğru ass deepte bayılttınmı adamı kalkamıyor.Rog un sorunu tamamen matematik sorunu bence.Okadar düzensiz ki verdiğim dmgler missler dodge lar.Stealtten çıktıysan eğer bi şekilde saldım çayıra mevlam kayıra hesabı...

[Asgard]

assasinin finisherlarının dmglarını arttıracaklar oyunun forumunda adamın teki ben 500 crit vuruyorum warrior 1500 vuruyor diyor yani hakkatten öle,zaten classları düzeltmezlerse roglar sadece mm/ranger mageler pyro clericler warden felan gidecek

assasin feedback

[Loex]

warden denemedim ama shaman bayaa iyi ya bunu dışında

farklı kombinasyonlar olması lazım yoksa wow daki gibi her class aynı buildle oynar

[Asgard]

demek istediğim o yani melee clericler ağlıyor oyun içinde ve forumlarda,mageler ölmüş diyolar zaten,mm/sab varken assasin oynanmaz diyolar(zaten beta serverların %60 ı marksman) warriorlarda bi problem yok sanirim yada ben ilgilenmediğimden bilmiyorum.Tabi daha önümüzde 1-2 beta daha olacak çok şey değişir ama beta 6 nın durumu bu.

[sardius]

assassinle lvl 30 a kadar geldim. pure meleeyim assassin/bladedancer/nightblade. bu kombinasyonda da dps fena degil ama yapılan en ufak cc ye karsı hic bir savunmanız olmuyor. cok kolay ölüyorsunuz. assassin oynayıp ben adam kesecem diyosanız bence riftstalkerda min 14 puan vererek rift shift ve shadow stalk almak mecburi gibi. ama bu seferde dps düsüyor. ben su an assassni sadece solo lvl kasmada zevkli ve kullanıslı bulldum.

finisherların yanında assasinate gibi stealth moddayken kullanılan skillerinde dmglerinin artması gerekiyor. yukarda denildigi gibi ben max 570 crit vurdum ama 1020 dmg yedim baskasından aynı lvl. lvl 30 da lvl 35 bi sabot beni 3 sn de kesti. hic bişi yapamadım dmg lere baktım 970-380-400 küsür bişiydi öldüm direk adama vuramadan.

[Asgard]

lvl 10-20 warfrontunda assasinimi sabo yaptım dediğin gibi 3 snde kesiyorum milleti sadece 2 tus bomba at 5 combo olunca patlat direk yatış

[trathias]

aynen ben de denedim sabotagerı inanılmaz bi damage yapıyo pvpde targetın %60-80 hpsini tek vuruşta götürebiliyosun. ilk nerflenecek soul diye düşünmekteyim

[Asgard]

çok zevkli ya haha adam ne oldugunu anlamıyo beni kovalarken warfrontta herif ölüyo direk mal oluyo.En az 3 kişiye ragequit yaptırmışımdır sdf

[trathias]

15 lvl da 30k dps 15 kill blow yaptım üstümde lvl8 itemleri falan vardı :D
ayrıca 29 warriorumla oynarken en çekindiğim class da sabotager. wf(20-29)da bana 1k vuruyolardı hakikaten ne olduğunu anlamadan patlıyosun.

[sardius]

valla 2saattir bi lvl 35 defiant sabot bizim bölgede dolanıyo herif yüzünden quest yapaıyorum reskill maya yaptı beni :) pvp serverında oynama konusunda süphe olustu icimde :P